...who among you actually believe...

[Biomechanoid]

Didn't know the bear was ticklish...

[Darkest Angel]

...learn something new everyday, eh? Hey, maybe you are on a path of learning. Meaning that you aren't necessarily supposed to find a solid answer. Ever think of that? [img]wink.gif[/img]

Which brings me to my next thought, which is that a lot of eastern philosophies/religions argue that we all have a path to follow, but it isn't concrete and we must find out own ways. If we deviate from it there are consequences, there's no "free pass" from some outside force who will tweak us back to where we belong--although you can, apparently, take a rather roundabout way to get where you belong, in at least some cases. See karma.

So, then, we have to address the issue of "the greater good"...that there is a higher purpose that must be served, regardless of our frail, tranquil, human notions of "good" and "evil". In other words, if my actions, on their face, are "evil", but serve this greater good, I was never evil at all, and my "path" is still intact.

--that's all under the assumption, of course, that our lives have any meaning whatsoever, and we aren't just flattering ourselves... [img]wink.gif[/img]

[Andyman]

Yes, but sometimes you gotta stray from the path to take a leak. [img]wink.gif[/img]

[Biomechanoid]

Originally posted by -Dark Angel-:
Ever think of that? [img]wink.gif[/img]

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">My quest hasn't ended. While I practice to grow spiritually within the faith I have, I still keep an eye out for other aspects that I may have overlooked before or have forgotten. The answers I have aren't solid, per se, but their the best I have at any given moment. My faith is constantly evolving because I am learning. Now, whether or not I'm supposed to or destined to learn the whole truth is something I no longer worry about. To me, the journey is just as important as the destination.

I believe there is merit in Karma. Newton was speaking of physics, but the law that states that every action has an equal and opposite reaction has other applications. Christ said that what goes around comes around. However, if the ends are known, that what concern should we have about the means? If my fate is to die in a car crash can I be expected to jump out of a 32nd floor window and live? Do I invite misfortune by challenging this notion?

Your greater good point is another can of worms entirely. You mentioned Hitler earlier. By your example, another perspective could reveal that his actions - evil and unjustified - resulted in an era of advancement and prosperity. Though the human cost was terrible, consider that countless lives since then have been saved or enhanced by the chain of technology that received an immense growth spurt from the war waged to end his reign. Flattery maybe, but I personally consider it an insult to imagine that all of those lives, including the sacrifices made now, are ended in vain. The value of death is just as great as life.

[Biomechanoid]

Originally posted by Andyman:
Yes, but sometimes you gotta stray from the path to take a leak. [img]wink.gif[/img]

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Or was it your destiny to leak?

[Darkest Angel]

...I think its his destiny to irritate me... [img]wink.gif[/img]

[Danathor]

i believe in more like people who are more in touch with the spiritual world, and can "see" stuff that's going to happen, but cant grasp it and harness it the way these bogus psychics and crap claim they can, like almost deja vu, but on a higher level

[Darkest Angel]

...dan, I think that is very sensible.

As for Nostro...so, we are talking about gradients of destiny? I have a hard time with that. If you are not meant to jump out of the window, the thought wouldn't cross your mind, am I right? Or, if it did, you would lend it no credence. Is it possible that, while certain things are primarily intended to happen to intended people, that they nevertheless can undergo "correction" even to the point of finding a surrogate, similar person to center them on? Maybe that is why none of us is quite as "orginal" as we like to think...some of us are the understudies of Fate!

...me...I have always had the sneaking suspicion that I just might jump one day...

[Biomechanoid]

Originally posted by -Dark Angel-:
As for Nostro...so, we are talking about gradients of destiny? I have a hard time with that. If you are not meant to jump out of the window, the thought wouldn't cross your mind, am I right? Or, if it did, you would lend it no credence. Is it possible that, while certain things are primarily intended to happen to intended people, that they nevertheless can undergo "correction" even to the point of finding a surrogate, similar person to center them on? Maybe that is why none of us is quite as "orginal" as we like to think...some of us are the understudies of Fate!

...me...I have always had the sneaking suspicion that I just might jump one day...

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">That is possible. That analogy was made in the Matrix, where programs were sent to "correct" the human mind that had exceeded its perameters. I don't get the sense that our free will is bound by those factors. Fate says that the building was put there for you to jump out of it, I say you had to enact the will to open the window. In your case, however, your wings would start flapping involuntarily and there'd be no point in it anyway. [img]wink.gif[/img]